Thoughts On Combo Chains...

Some wrestlers have a set couple of moves they do in a string of attacks. Cena with his Diving shoulder blocks, CM Punk with his running knee to the corner into the running bulldog... things like that...

Me and Malice were chatting it up and though, "What if we made a system like that too?"

Here's how it could look... You get up to (We haven't decided this number yet... 3 sounds good, 5 could be too, but we'll have to see) moves and this will be your 'signature series' of attacks. The opening move would be fairly weak, but have a sound amount of accuracy. Any connecting moves would be fairly powerful, but they would all lead to the ending move which is almost always more damaging than the rest of the moves...

So, by design, it would probably be something like this.
First Move = Tier 1 through Tier 3 moves can be used as 'Combo Starters.'
Second Move = Tier 1 through Tier 5 moves can be used as 'Combo Enablers'
Final Move = Tier 1 through Tier 8 moves to be used as 'Combo Enders'

So, Taking Snap as an example Let's say I wanted to make a Snapshot Special. I would (like to have) a drop down list that does the following

Let's me choose a move to start the combo with. For Awesome sake, I'll choose the Spinning European Uppercut. It's a tier 2 move, so it is acceptable.

This move would turn my foe around, so for the next move I would have a selection of behind moves that are ranked 1-5. I'll take the German Suplex, since it's only rank 4. I would love some of the bigger moves that behind has to offer, but that's just not how this thing works. lol

The Final move would have to be grounded, since that's the position that German Suplex offers, but since this is the end of the chain, any grounded move would be fair game. So, the Shooting Star Press seems like a fitting ending for it.

Looks nice, fits with all the requirements, and makes me feel special and creative! But, What would be the downside to this? What would it take to have it go into effect? How many times a match could/would someone be able to attempt this combo?

I'm glad you asked. I'm still thinking about it. But I'd LOVE to see some suggestions. lol

Personally, I don't think these should be allowed to be attempted more than twice a match TOPS. (Unless someone can tell me a reason to do so otherwise.) I think the charisma skill would be VITAL in making these fire off at all.

A few notes:

I think the combos should ignore the quickness attack chain feature. Makes little sense to set up a great combo, and then it gets broken up. If at all possible, it should count as one move.

My thought is no more than 4 moves to a chain. Even the biggest ones are just 4 moves. Take John Cena's 5 moves of doom, as an example. it's 2 shoulder blocks, followed by a blue thunder bomb, followed by a modified fist drop. That's his 4 move combo, then he hits a finisher, be it the STF or the Attitude adjuster.

The combos are FAR from automatic, should they get used. Every move has a decreasing chance to be countered as the momentum builds. Meaning your best chance to stop it is in the first move. I also think each move after the first should only do about 75% to 80% (at MOST) of the damage. Blocks, by nature break the combo, though they don't pass control. Dodge automatically passes control.

To perform a combo, I think you should need the momentum to do EVERY move on your combo. So you couldn't trigger the combo 4 moves into the match and end with a choke slam or sit out power bomb, but you could do that later in the match after acquiring the max momentum needed to perform each move.

So in my before example of Cena, there would have to be a standing running shoulder tackle move. I think we can make specific moves with chains in mind, like a punch that knocks the opponent down only for him to pop back to his feet, etc.

Tell us your thoughts on this, please. We are hungry for feedback.

Personally, I don't think these should be allowed to be attempted more than twice a match TOPS. (Unless someone can tell me a reason to do so otherwise.) I think the charisma skill would be VITAL in making these fire off at all.

I was going to say the same thing there tbh Or, as a little "twist" if it's not too hard to code or too Sci-Fi, you start with only 1 attempt and increase it to 2 and 3 (max, no more imo) attempts per match after you increase a certain stat (Charisma seems to fit best imo).
What do you think?

I believe that 4 moves in that personalized chain would be enough. Also, the finisher could maybe be set to trigger right after this combo? Not like only after this combo, but if you complete the combo finisher could pop up? Also, since it's at the end of this combo, the finisher could have higher chance of making people bleed / pin them / injure them at a cost of course...probably lower chance of hitting it due to being to tired (lost breath)? Then again, the opponent is also quite beat up, so not sure if it'd make sense lol comment anyway

To perform a combo, I think you should need the momentum to do EVERY move on your combo. So you couldn't trigger the combo 4 moves into the match and end with a choke slam or sit out power bomb, but you could do that later in the match after acquiring the max momentum needed to perform each move.

If I understand this right, it means that different combos will fire off at different times yes? As in if you go for a 4 move combo and pick , in order, Tier 1 - Tier 2 - Tier 3 - Tier 4, you'll be able to hit it faster than someone with Tier 2 - Tier 4 - Tier 4 - Tier 7 combo, yes?
So you could hit it faster, but at the cost of some damage (considering you'll be using lower Tier moves).

Regardless if it'll be 3 or 4 moves in the combo, should it be a must? Or leave it to player's preference to chose if he wants a 2 chain (minimum) or 4 chain (maximum)?

No matter how long the combo will be, I believe that a Pin or Sub move can only be used as the combo ender. Makes sense to me as I don't see people having a 3 combo move and 2nd one to be a Pin or Sub for example...unless they are counting for that move to ALWAYS be escaped out of lol

Just my humble thoughts

I would be perfectly happy to let the user determine how long a combo they want, though not to exceed 4 moves.

Although, I think I'd like to see the transition moves (Pick up from grounded, turn around, bend over...) not count as moves for the purposes of the combo. That would help with the Cena example of Shoulder Block, (pick up), Shoulder Block.... Perhaps only allow one transition move per combo to make things more smooth perhaps?

Also, when I was talking with Malice about this, we discussed how this would *need* to be balanced... So, we figured something like...

First move does less damage (I'm personally leaning towards 55% myself, but that is no where near set in stone...), Next move is at 70% (or 15% higher than the last, in the event we change it.), Next move is 85%, and the Final move would be at 110% since that's the entire point of the combo. Bigger combo, bigger chance to get countered, bigger pay off.

(Sadly, I can see a lot of combos ending with an ankle lock. =P)

So... More like this.

Hit End - 110%
Hit 3 - 85%
Hit 2 - 70%
Hit 1 - 55%

If you only use 3 hits though, just take out hit 1 and use that table instead.... Only use two hits? Hit 3 and Hit End then... The drawback to not using the full four? Lesser accuracy bonus for the final hit? Hmm? Yay? Nay?

MORE RESPONSES PLZNAO!

Just a thought on the matter.

Have you thought about the % of time that the combos will hit?

Like...once the first move hits:

2nd move: 80% to hit
3rd move: 60% to hit
4th move: 40% to hit
5th move: 20% to hit

so that if you hit the first move, you don't automatically hit the f*** button on your opponent with 5 moves.

Chris Legend wrote:Just a thought on the matter.

Have you thought about the % of time that the combos will hit?

Like...once the first move hits:

2nd move: 80% to hit
3rd move: 60% to hit
4th move: 40% to hit
5th move: 20% to hit

so that if you hit the first move, you don't automatically hit the f*** button on your opponent with 5 moves.

Well that was a thought I had myself when we were discussing it earlier. Maybe 30% chance to attempt the combo if all other criteria are met when you happen to perform the first move in the chain. Meaning it's still not an auto hit button, just because you set it up to be so.

Well, my thought is that not even Cena will ALWAYS nail all 5 "Moves of Doom".

Instead of having 30% to hit the entire combo, I think it should be tiered so that your opponent has a chance to escape without incurring the full combo.

This is just my thought though. Take it as you will.

Instead of having 30% to hit the entire combo, I think it should be tiered so that your opponent has a chance to escape without incurring the full combo.

If anything, I'd want it to be either...

1. High accuracy in the beginning, but less accuracy as the Combo goes on.
Reason - Everyone KNOWS what's coming next, especially your foes.

2. Low Accuracy in the beginning, but grows in accuracy as the Combo goes on.
Reason - Your adrenaline has your fired up, and nothing is going to stop you now!


Either way, I can see a reason for one or the other. That's why I want more input!

Sad Panda, When UWE was in planning i remember mentioning moves chains and no one listened.

When the powerful female says it everyone listens ,


Anyway i like the way it is set up, or being proposed by snapples

I was also thinking that maybe there should be a certain amount of attempts to hit the Chain, and only a certain amount of succesful hits

I would be perfectly happy to let the user determine how long a combo they want, though not to exceed 4 moves.

Yes, between 2 and 4.

Hit End - 110%
Hit 3 - 85%
Hit 2 - 70%
Hit 1 - 55%

If you only use 3 hits though, just take out hit 1 and use that table instead.... Only use two hits? Hit 3 and Hit End then... The drawback to not using the full four? Lesser accuracy bonus for the final hit? Hmm? Yay? Nay?

I like the % of the moves. As for the drawback, you either get less accuracy for the final hit or we lower the %.
Say 5% less for each move in the combo for every move you take out of the 4 combo. But this may mean we increase the % for the 4 combo a bit.
Example:
4 Hit Combo
Hit End - 120%
Hit 3 - 105%
Hit 2 - 90%
Hit 1 - 75%

3 Hit Combo
Hit End - 115%
Hit 3 - 100%
Hit 2 - 85%

2 Hit Combo
Hit End - 110%
Hit 3 - 95%

You like?

1. High accuracy in the beginning, but less accuracy as the Combo goes on.
Reason - Everyone KNOWS what's coming next, especially your foes.

2. Low Accuracy in the beginning, but grows in accuracy as the Combo goes on.
Reason - Your adrenaline has your fired up, and nothing is going to stop you now!

Was thinking of that and I would go for the 2nd one

was also thinking that maybe there should be a certain amount of attempts to hit the Chain, and only a certain amount of succesful hits

I already proposed this:

I was going to say the same thing there tbh Or, as a little "twist" if it's not too hard to code or too Sci-Fi, you start with only 1 attempt and increase it to 2 and 3 (max, no more imo) attempts per match after you increase a certain stat (Charisma seems to fit best imo).
What do you think?

Example:
4 Hit Combo
Hit End - 120%
Hit 3 - 105%
Hit 2 - 90%
Hit 1 - 75%

3 Hit Combo
Hit End - 115%
Hit 3 - 100%
Hit 2 - 85%

2 Hit Combo
Hit End - 110%
Hit 3 - 95%

You like? Razz

I would be happy with these numbers. More risk, more reward. I can always approve of that sentiment. We *might* have to tweak them later, but for starters, I can see this being a good baseline to work from.

I also agree with your 'x amount of attempts to try the combo' too. It should be completely charisma based if we use it off the 'You're pumped and nothing can stop you' dynamic. lol

As you said, "nothing is set into stone", but at least as an idea so we can all see what we're talking about.

And glad you like my idea

Chris Legend wrote:Well, my thought is that not even Cena will ALWAYS nail all 5 "Moves of Doom".

Instead of having 30% to hit the entire combo, I think it should be tiered so that your opponent has a chance to escape without incurring the full combo.

This is just my thought though. Take it as you will.

It's a 30% chance to enter into the combo chain, not to just hit the whole thing. Perhaps I didn't adequately express myself. You won't always go for move 2 of the combo after landing move one. However, with my idea there's a 30% chance to enter "chain mode" where you either get improved damage or accuracy or whatever, and you'll attempt to complete the chain. If you haven't already tried twice before, of course.

The combo idea was never made to be 'land these hits without any escape. Each move would naturally have to make a to-hit check, and be subject to all that jazz, but each successive hit (in addition to the aforementioned damage debuffs/buffs) would add an extra bit of accuracy. Once it gets going, it's hard to stop, so stop it early.

We might want some way to indicate a combo has been attempted too, more than just "Lands punch, lands body slam, lands diving headbutt."

Something closer to (again, subject to change without notice): Lands a Punch LOOKS LIKE THEY'RE GOING FOR IT!!! Lands body slam...ect.

Snapshot wrote:Once it gets going, it's hard to stop, so stop it early.

That's the idea. Make it better so people are interested in getting it, but without making it a "guaranteed I win thing".

Snapshot wrote:We might want some way to indicate a combo has been attempted too, more than just "Lands punch, lands body slam, lands diving headbutt."
Something closer to (again, subject to change without notice): Lands a Punch LOOKS LIKE THEY'RE GOING FOR IT!!! Lands body slam...ect.

Maybe have something like we have for bleeding/injury stages after we land the moves:
1st move - That's how it usually starts...
2nd move - Oh yeah, he's/she's going for it!!
3rd move - He's/She's on a roll!!
4th move - It's all over!!

Not those exact phrases if you don't like them

And if people go for 2 or 3 move combo, then just drop 1 or 2 of those phrases? *shrug*

If we do it like that, we might want to come up with the name of a ring announcer to use to be the one to tell everyone "Oh man! Here It Comes!"

I'm not sure if multiple ring announcers would work (i.e. randomize which announcer says it) considering if it goes off twice, the 'randomness' might be two different announcers saying it...

What do I know? I do ideas, not implementation. lol

lol 1 announcer should be enough